Comments on: How Did a Watermelon End Up in the Story of Yud Tes Kislev?

By: Yosef Yitzchak Kratz

Yosef Yitzchak Kratz — Wed, 14 Dec 2022 00:41:29 +0000

In reply to Hebrew.

ב”ה

הסיפור נזכר על ידי הרביים?

הרבה פרטים בסיפור המאסר המקובל לא הולכים יחדיו עם הסיפור המסופר על ידי הרביים.

ואף שיש מעלה בסיפורים שסופרו בין חסידים. הנה עיקר הקאך במה שסופר על ידי הרביים.

ואכמ”ל.

By: Source?

Source? — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 16:59:43 +0000

In reply to פלוצער.

1) What makes you say the Hebrew and Yiddish were written by the SAME person?
In the version I found it says it was translated and compiled by י.ח.
2) Not that I know differently – but just wondering if you have a source that the translation of פלוצער is pumpkin?

By: פלוצער

פלוצער — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 14:42:53 +0000

The word פלוצער means a pumpkin
The fact that in the original it says אבטיח:
1. It can also translate to pumpkin (check out google translate if you wish)
2. There was no modern Hebrew back then.
So, some the Yiddish and Hebrew version were written by the SAME person – it only makes sense to say that he meant pumpkin

If I would be able to, I would upload some pics to prove all the above…

By: Observer

Observer — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 14:20:57 +0000

You can observe many times especially by Israelis when they write down Yiddish words the letters Aleph and Hei are often exchanged (for no reason that I can ever figure out)
So the fact that by the glitzenshtein book it’s printed ארבוז and not harbuz is not an indication.

However even if in Ukrainian bits spelled or pronounced Harbouz, in Russian that would be Garbuz similar to Belarusian Horodna is pronounced in Yiddish (and Russian) Grodna, so to mistake a G for an A is a stretch

The writer’s “theory” is interesting and it would be nice to know if there can be sources traced to support it but it’s not enough based on a question you have to come and change a story.

That’s how broken telephone works and how stories end up polar opposites than where they began, because of a question someone could not figure out!!!!

By: Researched

Researched — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 05:29:57 +0000

המשך
in a yiddish-hebrew book it says “דלועין-פלוצער”

By: S G

S G — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 05:29:26 +0000

Sorry – on page לט. (Autocorrect…)

By: Zikaron

Zikaron — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 05:18:06 +0000

in the Arrest and Liberation page 44 it says “an envelope” fell

in the Hebrew Beis Rebbi, page 30 it says אבטיח

i remember seeing in the YIDDISH version of beis rebbi “א פלוצער” fell. no clue what that means

By: Read Bais Rebbi

Read Bais Rebbi — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 04:20:02 +0000

Sorry, but in the original Bais Rebbi (in loshon hakodesh) it says (on page ל):
“פתאום ראה שמחלון עליית בית השר נפל אבטיח…פתחו האבטיח”

By: Aharon

Aharon — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 03:48:13 +0000

This error was pointed out on a Ukrainian shluchim’s wattsapp group several years ago.

By: Beis Rebbe

Beis Rebbe — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 03:42:49 +0000

In reply to S G.

The story presumably comes from the sefer בית רבי, which was printed in the 1900’s in Yiddish and Loshon Kodesh. The Loshon Kodesh version has the word אבטיח, which generally means watermelon and the Yiddish version says פלוצער (I do not know the meaning of that word).
Although the watermelon popular today is harvested in the summer and has a thinner rind, not all varieties were like that, there are Russian varieties that have a thicker rind and are available deep into the winter, and this story probably took place much earlier than that – toward the beginning of the Alter Rebbe’s imprisonment.

By: Hebrew

Hebrew — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 02:48:59 +0000

1. Thanks for putting it out to the public – this was something discussed by my family members for a while now… 🙂

2. In Hebrew אבטיח translates as watermelon OR squash.
Apparently the original story was written in Hebrew (mokor ?) and that’s the word used.

By: S G

S G — Tue, 06 Dec 2022 01:30:08 +0000

In the old Yiddish Kehos book ארעסט און באפרייאונג פון אלטן רבין compiled by הרב אברהם חנוך גליצנשטיין on page number לא where it recounts this story it is written אַרבוז…

By: Naye Maysos

Naye Maysos — Mon, 05 Dec 2022 23:12:16 +0000

I’m no expert, just a product of chabad moisdos from the 80s and 90s. NEVER in the retelling of the story in all of my years have I ever heard someone tell the story with a watermelon! The first time i heard of it was when my child arrived home in recent years with a watermelon project from school in honor of 19 kislev leaving me beyond confused.